Not Surprised
I was surprised to see so many big-upping the team before kickoff, that should probably be mentioned.
However, in the aftermath of that result,I think I sum up the mood here by saying that we aren't surprised.
In a series like this, one of the best parts is that you see how coaching and preparation really play a part, and simply put the ABS were just tactially inept againt a team that came ready to shut down plays that had worked last week.
Our defense was just as porous as last week, while their's was much harder to breakdown. That's analysis, coaching, and player preparation. Which of those is the problem (likely all three) doesn't matter, as this series is showing that we don't have the right leadership to respond to challenges until they are presented to us.
In other words, no-one appears to have considered that Ireland would improve.
You look at individual skill errors, and you wonder how the ABs went from being the best skilled team in the world, to being very average - pretty much from the time we sent Mick away.
Can anyone define how the ABs play? I can't. We don't have a pattern, and certainly not one that endeavours our 'brand' to be worth hundreds of millions of dollars.
We'll win next week due to the immense pride bashing the players will be feeling, especially if that Irish fluffybunny called our skip a second-rate McCaw..
But, that could be the worst thing possible, as it will likely hide the rot at the heart of the current team. European clubs have better coaching teams than the ABs. Something is very very rotten with the entire set-up, and we should start by getting rid of the useless fluffybunnies in the boardroom who rubber-stamped the appointment of Foster, his re-appointment, and especially the appointment of his sub-standard assistants.
@MiketheSnow said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@stodders said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Are NZ playing Wales and Scotland in Nov? May as well knock those unbeaten records out whilst Foster is at the helm.
We’ve beaten you
Last century
I meant long unbeaten streak. Apologies Mike.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life here I am still waiting for you to tee off ?
I'm too drunk to tap it out on the phone!
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I'm still so angry how hugely our forward pack got rolled tonight.
Even before the cards that some will use as excuses for their favourites
A Savea was shown for his complete lack of physicality
DP was completely invisible.
Scott Barrett missed two assignments that led to points
The front row who weren't Bower sucked (Bower was really good and I'm becoming a huge fan)
Yes Ofa fucked everything but it was shit. The lineout was predictable. The scrum was scratchy
PGS is not good enough to be a test player and it's a disgrace he gets a jersey.
We need new leadership
All of these points are far too reasonable.
Go have a few more beers and come back when you have your Perth game ready.
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Foster now has the worst win % of any All Blacks coach since 1980, including losing to Argentina once and Ireland twice.
i honestly don't know why they selected him. How could he have been the best candidate with his record? And his record isn't that much better now.
And he's fat.
Their 10 mouthed off and slapped a guy after their first try and what was our response???
Fucking. Nothing.
We are soft. And the on-field representation of our head coach. Fucking disgraceful.
Scott Fucking Barrett is apparently our enforcer. I'm not scared of Scott Barrett, let alone Josh van de flier
Ardie savea our locked in #8 is Liam Messam from Wish.
Our skipper might be old but at least he hits things
DP may as well have stayed home
Taylor is cooked.
Before the fucking Hurricanes fans pile in and go at me because their only 2 all Blacks suck
Irelands first try. Savea is the 2nd tackler. A good loose forward immediately challenges that ball on the ground. No, Ardie reels away for some fucking reason. A quick recycle and we're doomed (shit tackle attempt by WT toi)
He's just not that guy for the tough stuff. He's a cat.
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Their 10 mouthed off and slapped a guy after their first try and what was our response???
Fucking. Nothing.
We are soft. And the on-field representation of our head coach. Fucking disgraceful.
Scott Fucking Barrett is apparently our enforcer. I'm not scared of Scott Barrett, let alone Josh van de flier
Ardie savea our locked in #8 is Liam Messam from Wish.
Our skipper might be old but at least he hits things
DP may as well have stayed home
Taylor is cooked.
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
2020/2021/2022 Pfff.... I am numb. So we badly lost to Ireland in NZ. We lost to an underdone Argentinian side in Aussie. You accepted that. I give you guys a couple of days before this is swept under the carpet.
The carpet is getting a bit lumpy under there, but I was under no illusion that post 2019 RWC we were in for a roller coaster. It’s never great to see your team lose and lose pretty badly like we did tonight, but this is where we are at and from week to week we are going to see these fluctuations in performance. There’s a host of factors, I guess it comes down to whether we need a circuit breaker (or several) right now.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
2020/2021/2022 Pfff.... I am numb. So we badly lost to Ireland in NZ. We lost to an underdone Argentinian side in Aussie. You accepted that. I give you guys a couple of days before this is swept under the carpet.
The carpet is getting a bit lumpy under there, but I was under no illusion that post 2019 RWC we were in for a roller coaster. It’s never great to see your team lose and lose pretty badly like we did tonight, but this is where we are at and from week to week we are going to see these fluctuations in performance. There’s a host of factors, I guess it comes down to whether we need a circuit breaker (or several) right now.
Circuit breaker? Without covid we are looking at tonight fielding that 2019 pack again
We ain't learning shit.
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Before the fucking Hurricanes fans pile in and go at me because their only 2 all Blacks suck
Irelands first try. Savea is the 2nd tackler. A good loose forward immediately challenges that ball on the ground. No, Ardie reels away for some fucking reason. A quick recycle and we're doomed (shit tackle attempt by WT toi)
He's just not that guy for the tough stuff. He's a cat.
The worst part of it is he was back to his feet in a flash and could've gone hard at van der Flier which may have unsettled the ruck, or at least made it messy for Gibson Park.
Ardie is a ruck watcher/ leaner. I'm fucking astonished how many people don't see it.
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Can anyone define how the ABs play?
Yes. A static pod doing their level best to negate any benefit of Aaron's pass. And even then they manage to fuck cleaning out and securing the ball quickly.
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
2020/2021/2022 Pfff.... I am numb. So we badly lost to Ireland in NZ. We lost to an underdone Argentinian side in Aussie. You accepted that. I give you guys a couple of days before this is swept under the carpet.
The carpet is getting a bit lumpy under there, but I was under no illusion that post 2019 RWC we were in for a roller coaster. It’s never great to see your team lose and lose pretty badly like we did tonight, but this is where we are at and from week to week we are going to see these fluctuations in performance. There’s a host of factors, I guess it comes down to whether we need a circuit breaker (or several) right now.
Circuit breaker? Without covid we are looking at tonight fielding that 2019 pack again
We ain't learning shit.
Circuit breaker of sacking coach, captain and not selecting certain players.
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Before the fucking Hurricanes fans pile in and go at me because their only 2 all Blacks suck
Irelands first try. Savea is the 2nd tackler. A good loose forward immediately challenges that ball on the ground. No, Ardie reels away for some fucking reason. A quick recycle and we're doomed (shit tackle attempt by WT toi)
He's just not that guy for the tough stuff. He's a cat.
The worst part of it is he was back to his feet in a flash and could've gone hard at van der Flier which may have unsettled the ruck, or at least made it messy for Gibson Park.
Ardie is a ruck watcher/ leaner. I'm fucking astonished how many people don't see it.
But but but
World XV and shit....
Blah blah
It's ridiculous how overlooked it is
He is not the new Rodney So'oialo because Rodney never saw a ruck he wouldn't clean
@mariner4life everything is ruined by having Ardie's name second on the team sheet. Just after we check if Cane is injured.
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Can anyone define how the ABs play?
Yes. A static pod doing their level best to negate any benefit of Aaron's pass. And even then they manage to fuck cleaning out and securing the ball quickly.
That flat shit meaning if the first tackle sticks we have no one to clean kills us
Last week they didn't make that tackle and we looked great. This week...
@FakatavaAllBlack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@kiwi_expat I wish Razor was appointed coach?
I'm sure that if he wanted to be an AB assistant, he would be.
I know that this is pure 100% speculation, but this is an AB loss and everyone deserves a turn at the fucking woodshed.
I can see why we might be better off with him there, don't get me wrong.
However, I'll bet that if he wanted to be there as part of the team, he had the opportunity and turned it down.
So, if he is looking at the situation and thinking, I could help, then the obvious answer is why aren't you already there? It's because you only wanted the top job.
Now, assuming I'm wrong and Fozzie didn't want to bring him in, we return to my previous point, which is to fire the fluffybunnies at the boardroom.
However, I'm not prepared to blow Robertson when he could have been there right now trying to help this team get better.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
2020/2021/2022 Pfff.... I am numb. So we badly lost to Ireland in NZ. We lost to an underdone Argentinian side in Aussie. You accepted that. I give you guys a couple of days before this is swept under the carpet.
The carpet is getting a bit lumpy under there, but I was under no illusion that post 2019 RWC we were in for a roller coaster. It’s never great to see your team lose and lose pretty badly like we did tonight, but this is where we are at and from week to week we are going to see these fluctuations in performance. There’s a host of factors, I guess it comes down to whether we need a circuit breaker (or several) right now.
Circuit breaker? Without covid we are looking at tonight fielding that 2019 pack again
We ain't learning shit.Circuit breaker of sacking coach, captain and not selecting certain players.
Honestly, I can't see us improving unless we pull the trigger and blow up the situation. Re-evaluate the entire organization and bring in specialists, regardless of whether they are kiwis or not.
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@gt12 F#$k, that is left field imaginary shite.
I did actually cite my sources.
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Foster now has the worst win % of any All Blacks coach since 1980, including losing to Argentina once and Ireland twice.
i honestly don't know why they selected him. How could he have been the best candidate with his record? And his record isn't that much better now.
And he's fat.
But not very substantial.
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@FakatavaAllBlack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@kiwi_expat I wish Razor was appointed coach?
I'm sure that if he wanted to be an AB assistant, he would be.
I know that is pure 100% speculation, but this is an AB loss and everyone deserves a turn at the fucking woodshed.
I can see why we might be better off with him there, don't get me wrong.
However, I'll bet that if he wanted to be there as part of the team, he had the opportunity and turned it down.
So, if he is looking at the situation and thinking, I could help, then the obvious answer is why aren't you already there? It's because you only wanted the top job.
Now, assuming I'm wrong and Fozzie didn't want to bring him in, we return to my previous point, which is to fire the fluffybunnies at the boardroom.
However, I'm not prepared to blow Robertson when he could ave been there right now trying to help this team get better.
That sounds like utter BS to me.You have no idea that is true or even close to it.
Our problem gents is
If you ever had to go through performance management of an employee you wanted to get rid of
Tonight we have
A terrible yellow card to a winger trying to charge a kick
A prop having an all time shit test
A prop getting red carded despite nearly knocking himself out
That geys very hard to say justified dismissal
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I was surprised to see so many big-upping the team before kickoff, that should probably be mentioned.
However, in the aftermath of that result,I think I sum up the mood here by saying that we aren't surprised.
In a series like this, one of the best parts is that you see how coaching and preparation really play a part, and simply put the ABS were just tactially inept againt a team that came ready to shut down plays that had worked last week.
Our defense was just as porous as last week, while their's was much harder to breakdown. That's analysis, coaching, and player preparation. Which of those is the problem (likely all three) doesn't matter, as this series is showing that we don't have the right leadership to respond to challenges until they are presented to us.
In other words, no-one appears to have considered that Ireland would improve.
You look at individual skill errors, and you wonder how the ABs went from being the best skilled team in the world, to being very average - pretty much from the time we sent Mick away.
Can anyone define how the ABs play? I can't. We don't have a pattern, and certainly not one that endeavours our 'brand' to be worth hundreds of millions of dollars.
We'll win next week due to the immense pride bashing the players will be feeling, especially if that Irish fluffybunny called our skip a second-rate McCaw..
But, that could be the worst thing possible, as it will likely hide the rot at the heart of the current team. European clubs have better coaching teams than the ABs. Something is very very rotten with the entire set-up, and we should start by getting rid of the useless fluffybunnies in the boardroom who rubber-stamped the appointment of Foster, his re-appointment, and especially the appointment of his sub-standard assistants.
Totally agree.
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
2020/2021/2022 Pfff.... I am numb. So we badly lost to Ireland in NZ. We lost to an underdone Argentinian side in Aussie. You accepted that. I give you guys a couple of days before this is swept under the carpet.
The carpet is getting a bit lumpy under there, but I was under no illusion that post 2019 RWC we were in for a roller coaster. It’s never great to see your team lose and lose pretty badly like we did tonight, but this is where we are at and from week to week we are going to see these fluctuations in performance. There’s a host of factors, I guess it comes down to whether we need a circuit breaker (or several) right now.
Circuit breaker? Without covid we are looking at tonight fielding that 2019 pack again
We ain't learning shit.Circuit breaker of sacking coach, captain and not selecting certain players.
Honestly, I can't see us improving unless we pull the trigger and blow up the situation. Re-evaluate the entire organization and bring in specialists, regardless of whether they are kiwis or not.
All Blacks should be a stepping stone for aspiring head coaches. We should be able to attract the best forwards coach, backs coach, defence coach etc. in the world. Instead we have Plumtree, McLeod and Mooar. We even payed Scarlets money to release him from his contract ffs.
It's literally written in line 2:
I know that is pure 100% speculation
If you can confirm that he was not offered or ever discussed as an assistant's position, I'm happy to take it back.
@MrDenmore said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
What has Foster achieved? What players has he developed? What innovations has he introduced? He has done nothing but made excuses and wrecked the careers of several players.
I don’t buy the ‘we lack the cattle’ line. The NZ-born players in the Irish team were mostly journeymen before they migrated. Coaching and strategy and leadership make the difference.
NZ has none of that. In the meantime, Foster, with the support of an incompetent leadership at NZ rugby are trashing one of the world’s leading sports brands.
Travesty.
Very true I am sad to say . Great Post
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Our problem gents is
If you ever had to go through performance management of an employee you wanted to get rid of
Tonight we have
A terrible yellow card to a winger trying to charge a kick
A prop having an all time shit test
A prop getting red carded despite nearly knocking himself outThat geys very hard to say justified dismissal
What about
-players out of position
-gamebreakers on bench
-doesn't know sub rules
-doesn't proactively create new team strategies
-doesn't use bench at right time
-relies on BB kicking at the wrong times and in the wrong places
-loses to all sorts of records
-has terrible winning record
-name a player who has improved under his coaching (Bower? Not improved under Crusaders?)
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
2020/2021/2022 Pfff.... I am numb. So we badly lost to Ireland in NZ. We lost to an underdone Argentinian side in Aussie. You accepted that. I give you guys a couple of days before this is swept under the carpet.
I don't think ppl are accepting it. I think we're at the apathy stage, because the NZRU won't do anything. So you numb the pain in the hope that it won't go on for longer than it has to.
You'd best hope the ABs don't fluke a WC win ?
@stodders said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
You'd best hope the ABs don't fluke a WC win ?
Foster retires and McLeod steps up as head coach based on experience and continuity. New Zealand goes on to lose to emerging nations USA and Canada.
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
How in the flying fuck could you watch SR this year and decide that Sotutu is third rate compared to Ardie and PGS?
His selection sums up the fucked up selectorial gymnastics these guys are going through.
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
How in the flying fuck could you watch SR this year and decide that Sotutu is third rate compared to Ardie and PGS?
His selection sums up the fucked up selectorial gymnastics these guys are going through.
Bro Ardie savea is like 2nd in the world bro!!!
Got nothing for PGS who ust makes the same errors he does at super level
Our pack is fucked because we just will not drop sacred cows
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
How in the flying fuck could you watch SR this year and decide that Sotutu is third rate compared to Ardie and PGS?
His selection sums up the fucked up selectorial gymnastics these guys are going through.
Bro Ardie savea is like 2nd in the world bro!!!
Got nothing for PGS who ust makes the same errors he does at super level
Our pack is fucked because we just will not drop sacred cows
And, when it mattered at Super level PGS went missing, so he is just the right player to back up Ardie at 8 for the ABs.
@MiketheSnow F3$K off with your Welsh standards. It has been a national disaster for a few years.